Sup, Well, in light of this upcoming tournament, I've decided to focus my attention on mastering the Jin cheese. You'll need the vs. Jin experience as well, so be ready for it. I looked over his frame data and have already devised a simple strategy. Thought I'd give you the basics of it since it's pretty solid and heavily based off frame advantage. I also wanted to write this down for myself. I might release a FAQ after the tournament. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Only moves I'll ever need ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 2,1 - Comes out in 10 frames. Whole thing connects on normal hit. Last hit gives me +1 blocked and +12 (!!!) on hit . 1,2,3 - Comes out in 10 frames. Last kick might be side steppable on block (we'll have to check), knocks down on normal hit and gives +3 on block. I think the whole thing connects on counter. db+1 (low punch) - Comes out in 8 frames. -2 block, +9 hit. Throws - all come out in 12 frames. Most powerful is QCB+1+3 (35 points) and is escaped with 1. The others do 30. WS+2 - Comes out in 15 frames, but -12 if blocked. laser scraper - Comes out in 16 frames. I have -2 if you block the 2nd punch and -9 if you block the last normal d+2. That is pretty much it. I also have d+3,3 which comes out in 15 frames, but has -15 on last hit if blocked so I won't be using it as much. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Misc moves ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- As for the parrys... I don't see myself risking it with the reliable attacks I already have except against really predictable attacks. Also note that 2,4 comes out in 10 frames and is guaranteed on normal hit. I'll be using it to punish whiffed or poor recovery attacks, but not in any other case. b+4 looks a lot like d+4 on start up. Recovers -7. Expect to see it as an end of round dink hit. d+4 low kick. I'll only be using it in combos, but might whip it out as a dink hit kill (mixed up with b+4). Recovers poor at -15. d+3+4 can can kick. I'll only use it after low parry so don't really need to discuss it. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Basic strategy ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1,2,3 ===== - Knocks down if last hit connets. - If blocked +3 1. 2,1 beats out counter attempts (safest option) 2. Throw or laser scraper defending opponents 2,1 === - If blocked +1 1. Do it again against non 8 frame jabbers 2. low punch against 8 frame jabbers (+1 means 8 frame low punch beats all counter attempts) or laser scraper peeps who try to parry low punch. - if 2,1 connects, mix up laser scaper and throws. +12 frame advantage means that laser or throw will interrupt all counter attempts. Opponent has no choice but to defend after a connected 2,1. low punch ========= - If blocked -2. I must defend. Can't really do much here. - If connects +9. 1. Mix up WS+2 or throw. +9 means both options will interrupt any counter attempts. Generally, against any character you should just defend if they connect with low punch since all options will usually beat out everything. 2. Crouch cancel with forward dash and mix up laser scaper and throws. Not as safe, but more damage if you get them to eat the scraper. Also, since ws+2 recovers bad, I will probably try this more instead. That sums up the core or the strategy. Looks simple enough, but extemely effective. Familiarize yourself with the situations where you MUST defend (after connected low punch and 2,1). Don't want to give the Jin player any free-bees.